Ep. 9: Mindset and Self-Love as the Path to Healing, with Dr. Natalie Kilheeney

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Welcome to Notes From Your Acupuncturist. The podcast for anyone who's interested in Acupuncturist complimentary medicine, holistic health, and self care. I'm your host, Alexa Bradley Hulsey. If you enjoy this show, you can help other people discover it by leaving a rating or a review, by following or subscribing on your favorite podcast listening app, or simply by telling someone about And if you'd like to support this show financially, you can become a paid subscriber on Substack for just a few dollars a month. Just head over to substack dot com and search no from your acupuncturist or click the link in the show notes. And one more thing before we get started, just a disclaimer that this podcast is for educational purposes only and is not a replacement for medical care from a qualified healthcare provider. Okay. On with the show.

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My guest today is Dr. Natalie Kilheeney. She's been practicing acupuncture for ten years and is the owner of Beyond Zen Studio in Granger, Indiana. Beyond Zen is a multidisciplinary wellness studio with thirty five employees providing acupuncture, herbs, functional medicine, yoga, pilates, massage, specialty holistic workshops and a retail boutique. Dr. Natalie has earned both masters and doctoral degrees in acupuncture and traditional Chinese medicine and has additional certification and specialization in five element functional medicine with a focus on women's health and fertility. She also teaches qigong workshops and is part of a shaman group. Natalie, welcome to the podcast. Thank you. It's such an honor. I'm so grateful to be here Alexa. Thank you. Thanks so much for joining me. You obviously love to learn, and I'm so curious to hear more about your journey. So I'm really glad you're here. Thank you.

0:02:00

So today's episode is about acupuncture, but we're also going to talk about the business of providing acupuncture. We're gonna talk about mindset, and we're gonna talk about some of my favorite topics, which are self care and self love. And we'll probably get into some other topics too. I can't wait. So you're the founder and owner of a busy multidisciplinary clinic. Which means that patients come to you, come to your space, not only for acupuncture, but obviously all kinds of other services too. And I really curious to hear more about this, because this is kind of the opposite of how I practice. At my clinic, we really just focus on acupuncture. We do some Chinese herbs as well, but our primary service is acupuncture. And so if a patient is interested and getting another service, we refer them out. So your practice really offers a wide range of services. So did you do you always know that you wanted to practice in this way in a multidisciplinary clinic? Well, what we do at the onset studio as we give patients and clients a well rounded array of options to get to the same source. And I gotta give it up to my team members. I mean, they're all just amazing and super passionate about each craft that they offer, and we do offer, you know, a multidisciplinary approach. That's correct. Everything we do has intention and purpose filled with a lot of love and care.

0:03:33

One of my favorite quotes from Thich Nhat Hanh is that Sitting is only one part of Zen. The practice of Zen is to eat, breathe, cook, carry water, and scrub the toilet. To infuse every act, body, speech, and mind with mindfulness, to illuminate every leap, every pebble, every heap of garbage, every path that leads our minds to return home. So essentially, we are leading people back to their innate nature, their divine light, which then facilitates their hewing journey. And we do that through yeah. We do that through the many modalities we offer through yoga, mindfulness, meditation, the ability to breathe into your body and connect to that inner source light. Pilates with strengthening and toning and massage, really getting the issues and the tissues as they say. And a lot of people are sitting at desks and are are just stagnant and there's a lot of pain nets created, you know, in the body. And then, of course, through my acupuncture practice, I practice the full enchilada, the full year. Yeah. Hey. So I do everything from Moxa Cupping, guasha, functional medicine acupuncture, you know, anything that is a tool in our toolbox, we're gonna provide that for you.

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That that quote from Thich Nhat Hanh, I mean, that sounds like it was the inspiration for your practice really? Yeah. It's just it's just about being intentional and purposeful and and everything that you you do. So you you mentioned your team and it sounds like you have an amazing team of practitioners working with you. So how did you find the people that you work with? How did you find these people to bring in and join you and and catch this vision that you have. Yeah. You know, I started my practice in a in a one room clinic. And really, when you put your light out there, and and this is a calling, I feel like acupuncture is a calling. When you have the courage to follow that and come from your heart, I I think that people start to find you and gravitate towards that same mindset and they share the same type of vision and purpose alongside of you. Yeah, that's beautiful.

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I wanna hear more about your patience too. So do most of your patience take advantage of the many services that you offer They do. So we are the go to place in our area, and and we're in Indiana. So so we've kind of been like the trailed blazers for yoga and acupuncture and really educating people on the on the benefits. So someone might start with one modality and then realize, you know what? I'm gonna I need help here, so I'm gonna be enter into this modality and they all kind of synergize and and work with one another. So we find that our our patients do a multiple array of services that we offer. Mhmm. So sort of one thing gets them in the door and then they start to feel better and start to explore the other services that you have? Exactly. Exactly.

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Have you had to do a lot of education to your community about the benefits of acupuncture and the other services that you provide? Absolutely. I mean, I've seen the acupuncture profession grow, especially in the last ten years becoming more mainstream, especially in the media, which has, you know, helped bring awareness to the benefits, but you know, moving back to Indiana, which is, you know, that I grew up in Southwest Michigan, which is just, you know, right up the street from my clinic. I've had to do a lot of educating because people don't know the value per se of alternative medicine, why it's important that there's alternatives other than drugs and surgeries, and that it works. And how do you help patients to navigate all of those choices that you have?

0:07:52

So say somebody comes in with with back pain. That's something that we acupuncturist treat all the time. And they come in and they're like, I wanna do everything. I'll do whatever I can to make this back pain go away. We hear that. So do you do you help do you sort of throw everything at the wall at once or do you sort of gradually introduce practices one by one? Or do you kind of judge what the patient needs and go at their pace? Yeah. Sort of sort of all of the above. If if somebody's coming in for acupuncture per se, they they might have done a little bit of research online, and maybe they have realized that it's helpful for pain management.

0:08:35

As an acupuncture is pain is probably one of the more popular reasons why a patient comes to you in the first place. Mhmm. But when you walk through our doors, I mean, we sit down with you and really kind of grasp where you're at and what your goals are and and try to see what what is a good fit for you. So everybody is a little bit different. Mhmm. When a patient comes in, a a new patient, do they have a consultation with you? Because sort of, like, what's that walk us through that journey of someone coming into your clinic. Yeah. So, well, I mean, I do have a team of front desk people that will chat with you and get a good sense of, you know, where you're at on your healing journey and what's a good fit. I do also offer fifteen minute consultations, which are free of charge, so a patient can come in and sit down with me and discuss their health concerns and their goals and how to move forward with that treatment plan. Yeah. So it sounds like it's really customized towards the patient's goals and what their needs are. Exactly. Yeah.

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That's one of the things that I love so much about Chinese medicine. It's just it's not a a one size fits all treatment. Every We see every patient is different. Everybody has different needs. Everyone's she is flowing a little differently, and so don't just do the same thing to every patient every time. Yeah. Exactly. And even in Chinese medical school, and we we learn a lot there in books. And that's the thing you gain with experience of treating patients is is exactly that that -- Mhmm. -- everybody's different everybody responds differently and that's part of the medicine. Yeah, it's part of the beauty of it. Exactly. Yeah.

0:10:25

Sometimes patients will ask me, like, oh, are you gonna just do the same points every time? Or do you do the same points on everybody? Or if I see another practitioner, are they gonna do the same points? I'm like, we've got hundreds of points to choose from. You are not gonna get the same points as everybody else. Exactly. So your your studio is obviously very busy. You've got a huge team. You offer tons of services. And you yourself treat eighty to a hundred patients a week.

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So how do you balance business ownership with patient care? Yeah, it's it's really important. I mean, I'm very passionate this is my colleague. So for me, it's not necessarily work. It's it's what I love to do is serving my community and and helping people and really transforming lives and empowering others on their healing journey, but self care, I mean, becomes a really important component in that whole mix. If you're not filling your own cup up first you can't give to other people. So you do have to balance that with your own sense of what brings you joy and do things for yourself. Yeah.

0:11:45

I'm glad you mentioned self care because we're gonna talk more about that later because it's so important. And I've talked to patients about self care, a lot. But as practitioners, we also have to practice self care too. So I'm we'll we'll get We'll circle back to self care in a little while because it's a really important topic. So you you obviously have a really successful practice. It's just so exciting to see.

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So what are some of the keys to your success? Well, I think being a heart driven leader, meeting with love and integrity and respect for others is an important key factor. And also helping your team grow by empowering them in their skills is a key factor. I think remembering the mission and purpose of why you're even doing this in the first place and connecting to that and revisiting that. Mhmm. It is super important as a leader. And then finally, just having a clear mind and a center core because -- Mhmm. -- along this journey, you're gonna inevitably face obstacles and challenges and roadblocks and you have to learn to adapt and pivot and change and you can't be afraid of that. Like, you have to be comfortable in the unknown and be able to step outside the box. I think as humans, we generally don't love change, Right. Right. But that's where all the magic and growth happens.

0:13:31

If you look at nature, and just a plant or even a tree that that becomes a tree. It it goes through all kinds of chaos and struggle just to reach the sunlight. Right. Right. And there are times when the tree seems to even die, you know, in the winter, when the leaves fall off and it's dormant, and it's just brown and branches and and no leaves. It seems like it's in this period of of not doing anything. When actually there's a lot going on with that tree. We just can't see it. Exactly.

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And I feel like our bodies work in a similar way from a clinical standpoint, we are nature -- Mhmm. -- in human form. And that's another thing that I love about Chinese medicine. Is that it's based on observation of the natural world. We've we look around and see what's happening in nature and then we will see it we see it reflected in the body. And then we treat the body accordingly. And that's why it's so powerful because it's aligned with the natural rhythms of the universe. Absolutely.

0:14:43

Each of these keys that you described, I I wanna dive into each of them because I feel like there's so much gold there. And and this is This is great advice, not just for acupuncturists who are building their practices. Although it is great advice for acupuncturists filling their practices, but also this is just good life advice for anyone and anyone struggling. So I wanna get into each of these a little bit more. So let's go back to the first one, which is you said you're heart centered and you come from a place of love. Have you always lived your life that way? Or is that something you've had to to cultivate and practice? Absolutely not.

0:15:22

You know, growing up, I was a highly sensitive person. And if you know anything about about that, the intensity of your environment is turned up. Mhmm. So you be comm sensitive to everybody else like emotions and it can be quite intense. And so I had to learn ways on how to not allow that outside noise or projection judgments, what other people think not infiltrate my my being and and allow that to define who I am. And I think that's important because we're not necessarily taught taught that and we internalize that and that can cause a lot of negative patterns to arise in our our being. And for me, I had to learn I had to learn how to love myself. I didn't I didn't do that. I didn't really know ways of doing that. Maybe I didn't think I was worthy or deserving of that love. And I think in society, like, we we we're not shown that. Right. We're not.

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And so it's so interesting to me then that he decided become an acupuncturist and that this is your calling because you interact with other people's energy all day every day. And so how do you how do you do that effectively? Well, at the same time, making sure that all of that doesn't become overwhelming for you emotionally or energetically. Exactly. And that is, I think, a part of the heelers pack. Right? Because we tend to take on the energy of others. So I think it's about creating healthy boundaries and knowing that that person is where they are on their journey. You can't do it for them. They have to -- Right. -- do it for themselves, but you're kinda there to coach them along and and help them along the path, but you're not to pick up that energy, which is not yours or the first place.

0:17:47

That's a lesson that I have learned over and over again and probably will continue to learn as an acupuncturist is that the patients on their own journey. And it's not my job to force anything. It's not my job to bring about an outcome that I think that they need because they might not truly be what they need. That's me projecting what I want for the patient, but the patient's on their own journey. That's exactly correct. And they they have to want it for themselves. And it's kind of like the the concept of like, the butterfly. Like, in the cocoon when it's a caterpillar. Like, you can't take that caterpillar out of the soon before it's ready or it dies. Right. It's gotta learn how to to come out of that and become the butterfly. Yeah. That's a great analogy.

0:18:43

The second key to success you mentioned was empowering your team, right, and supporting them to do so that they can do their best Yeah. Well, you you know, like, this is a collective effort and you can't do everything on your on your own. And the more you empower others and give them confidence, the more you grow within your team because they're they're able to kind of take it in their own way from their perspective to their clients. And I think as business owners, we tend to just wanna do everything ourselves. So I think that can be a real challenge to take a step back and let others do things in their own way and and empower them to do that.

0:19:39

So I'm wondering, like, yeah, was that a difficult lesson for you to learn or did someone Did someone do that for you? Did someone empower you? And is that how you learned how to do it? Or was it more just make a bunch of mistakes and learn from that? You know, probably a little bit of both. I mean, as a business owner, you're ultimately gonna make mistakes and fall down and let you get back up. And failure is just a lesson to teach you what doesn't work. That's so true. Was there someone who who did that for you? Who who modeled that for who showed who empowered you and showed you how to do that for others. Yeah. I think I've had some, you know, I think mentors along along the way. I mean, I think everyone should have people that you look up to that can teach you kind of the path. Maybe they'd bend down it before you or I learned from you know, different people along the way that have helped me as well.

0:20:47

So the third your third key to success, you said is is having a clear mind and having a clear vision. Is that right? Yeah. You you have to be able to have clarity for your vision. You have to know exactly what it is you you want to manifest because our thought are very powerful. You know, it's like, what are you creating? Are you coming from a place of fear? Because fear is always gonna be there, especially as a business owner. Thank you for saying that because, you know, we get messages like, oh, fear has no place here. You shouldn't have any fear, but you're right. It's always going to be there. Yeah. So you gotta learn how to transform the fear and be consciously aware of your thoughts. Like, are you coming from a place of love or are you coming from a face place of fear?

0:21:46

I've learned along the way that no decision is a good decision if you're making it from a place of fear. You're gonna ultimately create the very thing you don't wanna create because universal sort of set that up in a way where it'll teach you that lesson over and over again until you finally get it. So you wanna make sure that, you know, you're coming from that core sense of self. Mhmm. There's so many obstacles. And, I mean, if you look at the outside world, there's so many things that are gonna take you off of that every single day. Yeah.

0:22:27

And I feel like having having a clear head and having a core sense of self are so hard sometimes. So what advice do you have for people who maybe think, I I I wish I had a clear head and I don't. And I wish I had a course since itself and sometimes I don't even know who I am. Like, what obviously, there's no quick advice for that that where would you steer people who are struggling with that? Yeah. I mean, I I think it's having the courage to explore and try new things and put yourself out there. Even when you feel like you you can't. I mean, it's an ongoing process. Like, it it never really, there's no ending. There's no getting there. It's it's it's ongoing. And it's always changing too. Like, we're never the same that we were, you know, years ago.

0:23:22

So I want to shift gears a little bit and talk about mindset. Because you say that mindset It's really important. It's really the number one thing that you need to cultivate. So why's mindset so important? So maintaining a healthy mindset challenging for everybody. We carry patterns that we have been taught. Maybe we had an inherited when we were younger. And it's about unraveling the patterns that we've been functioning, in some cases, our whole life. We oftentimes are more comfortable in the pain that we know then in the effort it takes to make it better. That's so true. I think people tend to get stuck or remain stagnant. They fear change. Sometimes even in our clinics, our patients can attach themselves to a diagnosis or a state of being or define themselves by that very very thing becoming the victim and that can be challenging to change and overcome. And so I think how you break start to break the pattern is is through your mindset and being consciously aware of the thoughts and the stories that we tell ourselves. Because again, you know, our thoughts create reality, creates our lives.

0:24:55

A lot of times, I know and I struggled with this too, is going into the this type of of thinking. And what that does is it can wreak havoc on your nervous system and put it into overdrive, almost like we're being chased by a tiger. And then, you know, we're anxious. We're restless. We can't sleep. It affects our organ systems at a deep level. And and results in scattered energy. And in Chinese medicine, it affects the shed. Shed meaning, you know, spirit, which again resides in there. Yeah.

0:25:36

So I I would love to talk about the shen a little more, but First, I wanna I wanna back up a little bit and talk about more a little more about mindset because you talk about cultivating mindset. And so I think of that as an and not just a way of thinking. When you cultivate, you're putting intention into something. And it sounds like it sounds like you're saying that awareness is really the step. Yeah. Step one. There it is. So what advice do you have for people who are like in that step one phase? Of just becoming aware of their mindset? Well, I think it it goes back to the idea that we're all imperfect. Mhmm. Like, don't beat yourself up if you don't get it the first time or, you know, you're you find yourself back in that. Pattern. Mhmm.

0:26:26

I think it's like like journaling really helps, journaling your thoughts and and then kind of writing maybe affirmations of of the opposite. Like, if you tell yourself, like, not enough or I'm overweight. Mhmm. Or why can't I lose his weight? Or I'm always anxious or, you know, start to flip this script and and tell yourself the opposite. Like, I I love all the parts in myself. I am an Yes. I am worthy. Yes. And I would imagine that in the beginning, It's maybe challenging to to believe that. But just go with it is what you're saying. Right? Yeah. I think over time, you start to believe it. Yeah. So so you mentioned journaling for cultivating awareness, affirmations, for sort of starting to flip that script.

0:27:29

What other practices do you recommend for cultivating mindset? So, well, well, me personally, I'll do things like if I'm feeling stressed, I'll start to just dance in my living room. I love that. I love that. Because movement moves g, it moves your energy. So that's gonna shift your mindset automatically. So something as simple as that, I mean, anything creative, accretive outlet is whether it's art or writing or music, are really good tools to start. Yeah. And I think I think it's helpful if it's something fun and enjoyable. If painting is fun for you, great. Painting would not be fun for me because I would get so frustrated that whatever I'm painting does not look like how I want it to look. But if it's enjoyable for you, great. I I would be more of the dancing around the house kind of mindset person.

0:28:25

I think I think about my patients too, and a lot of my patients struggle with chronic pain or ongoing health issues. I'm sure it's the same with your patients as well. And so I imagine that for some people, it can be a struggle. To stay positive, to stay optimistic, to stay hopeful. So what advice you have for people who might be struggling to maintain that mindset of of hope and optimism and healing? See the course follow the treatment plan and, you know, work on the things that your practitioner is telling you to work on, whether it's diet or lifestyle or do the exercises or take the herbs, And, you know, it's a process. I think it's helpful too for people to celebrate small victories and notice incremental change because as I tell patients progress is not always in a straight line. So you may be gonna feel a little bit better and then feel a little bit worse and then might plateau for a little while. And just trust that you're still on the right path and celebrate those small victories when you get them. And I think can help people keep going too. Yeah. Absolutely.

0:29:49

You mentioned the Shen earlier, and such a fascinating topic. I feel like we could talk about the Shen for hours. But let's talk about it briefly because it's such an important component of what we do with acupuncture and Chinese medicine. So you mentioned that the Duchenne is the spirit. So I think of the sin as sort of like the totality of our emotional spiritual being. How do you approach treatment of the sham with your patients? Well, again, it's it's different for everyone, but when the Shen is not connected to the heart, it becomes scattered. And, you know, it can result in disease and disharmony and manifest in different ways for different people. But I think gaining a good sense of a grounding force in your body and and learning to really calm down. The nervous system is important for the Shen especially because it's it's moving erratic in that way. Yeah. And we say that if, you know, if it doesn't have a place to rest, if it doesn't have a place to rest of an insomnia is symptom that we'll see when the sinn is scattered and disturbed. Yeah. So -- Mhmm. -- it's learning how to create healthy patterns and through all of the things that we suggest.

0:31:27

So I wanna talk about something else you're passionate about, which is self care and self love. And I would love to hear more about your own self care journey and how you have found the practices that work for you. Yeah. So, again, kinda going back to growing up, I I didn't really have I started to internalize a lot of, like, negative thoughts towards my myself and sort of beat myself up and get over critical and internalize things that weren't true about myself. So that led me to a lot of destructive patterns and and habits that were were not good for me that were creating a lot of, like, toxicity and chaos in my life and and when I started acupuncture school, I found that Xi Jinping and acupuncture really changed my life. And it allowed me little by little to really start to love myself. I mean, I think self love. It's not selfish. Mhmm. It's it's not about the ego or saying we're better than other people or you know, in that sense, but it but it's critical. Like, if you're not gonna love yourself, then then who is, you know, you should be your biggest advocate because that shows other people how to love you and also it creates the stage for what you experience. And so, you you know, I had to learn these tools to be able to start doing that for myself. One of the one of the ways that I do that too is just by like, I'll get up and look in the mirror in the morning. And I will say things like, Natalie, you are the love your own life. That's so nice. What a great way to start the day? Yeah. I mean, it it it sounds silly, but it it really is helpful because we need that reminder, especially if you don't feel confident or, like, you're enough or or worthy or deserving of of love. So it's really simple exercise that you can do to to start to cultivate that mindset within yourself. Yeah. That's great.

0:34:06

You mentioned qigong and I'd love to talk a little bit more about qigong. So for for our listeners who maybe aren't familiar with qigong, why don't you just briefly define what it is first? Sure. So, I mean, qigong is about Well, I call it an acupuncture treatment, like, doing it sell like through self care. So you can tap on the meridians of the body to invigorate stagnant flow, but it's also about connecting the energy centers, we call them gantt ends in Chinese medicine through the breath. And, you know, allowing that energy to flow to your organ systems and and moving that through your body. So it's a mind body connection and it's not really hard on your joints and your body and it really starts to center you and create awareness of your body and your mind Yeah. That's one of the things that I love about it too. The movements are so gentle that anyone can do qigong. Anyone at any level of ability, age, fitness, anyone, literally anyone can do qigong. And it's it's not difficult to learn and it is. I I like that that thinking about it. It's like it's like acupuncture but moving instead of getting needles.

0:35:40

Now you you got your master's degree at Yo San University, which is also where I attended acupuncture school. Was that was your time at Yo San? Was that your first exposure to Qigong or had you learned Qigong before going to Yo San? No. I started. When I started at Yo San, that was my first experience with qigong and it was life changing. I mean, it started to shift my entire life. The people around me, the the way I thought, it just started to help me heal from a deep level emotionally and spiritually that I was blown away by it. And it was really cool to be around other, like, minded peeps that you know, felt the same way.

0:36:34

That is a that is a true testament to the power of qigong. And that's I think that's why so our school, Yo San, has pretty heavy qigong curriculum. I mean, it requires that the students take she gone and learned she gone the whole time that we're in school basically, which not every acupuncture school does. And that's I think one of the things that sets Yo San apart is because because students are continually cultivating their own tea through the practice of qigong. Yeah. I I call it the medicine behind the medicine it. Oh, I love that. Yeah. Yeah. So do you teach you teach qigong at your clinic. Correct? I do. So we'll offer on it occasion workshops that I'll do sort of a qigong type of workshop, but I'll also include puncture and maybe essential oils in a community type of setting for the community. So so yes, cool.

0:37:34

You know, you're talking about about qigong and the movement of it reminds me of earlier when we were talking about the shen and and how qigong really helped to shift your mindset and and help with some emotional imbalances that you had been carrying around for a long time. And I think it's just a real an example of how We have to be embodied to deal with things that aren't body centered. So things like anxiety and depression or other emotional issues. We think of those as all in our head, and they're not. They're in our body too. And so body movement, body awareness, body centered practices are so important for dealing with those psychological, emotional, spiritual challenges that we're all struggling with? Absolutely. I mean, it helps you cultivate again that that by mind body awareness because emotions will affect your organ systems. I mean, that's a basic principle in Chinese medicine that our emotions are not separate from ourselves. And they they have a direct effect on our overall health and can be the root of why something is occurring in the first place. So the more you can process that and move it and understand it and finally break free from that is is how you start to heal. That's right.

0:39:18

So you're obviously very big on self care for everyone. What advice would you have for people who are maybe struggling to develop their own self care practices? Well, I think a lot of times we'll make up excuses why why we can't take care of ourselves. Like, maybe we're people pleasers or we wanna take care of other people, so we don't have the time to take care of ourselves. Mhmm. And again, we we we can't fill up the cup of somebody else unless our cup is is full. So it's pertinent. It's pertinent to balance. It's pertinent to living a healthy whole life. And if you don't make time for yourself, like, who who's gonna make time for? You know? Right. I think it's helpful to maybe unpack those excuses too. Like, why am I trying to please everyone else instead of take care of myself and what's really underneath all that and what's at the root of that? It's a good question to explore.

0:40:28

For your fellow practitioners of acupuncture or holistic medicine, you know, we're all all of us who who practice medicine and take care of patients and really just take care of others in any kind of way. We're all on our own journey of self care and self love. For people specifically though who are practitioners, do you have any specific advice for those of us who might be struggling on our journey of self care and self love. I mean, I have confidence. You've been given a beautiful roadmap to the medicine we offer. Have confidence that it's in there, that you that you know. And if you don't know, you'll learn as you go and through experience, but the fact that you're out there bringing this medicine to the public. It's so important. So we have options for people in our medical system. And having divine confidence means you know who you are and you're okay with that. Just be you. Be your authentic's out. I love that.

0:41:40

You know, if there's anything that I am taking from this conversation, it's It's really that these practices are rooted in the body and they're not just It's not just about thinking. It's about moving and doing and really living within our body. And and also awareness is so important. That's really the first step is to just start with awareness and pay attention to what's going on inside. Exactly. So, Dr. Natalie, if people want to keep up with you and continue to be inspired by you and learn from you. Where can they find you? So our website is w w w dot beyondzend studio dot com. We're also on Facebook and Instagram. And also TikTok, you can follow us at beyond Zen Studio. And also, we do have a newsletter that you can sign up for on our website that comes out the first of the month. Great. And we will put links to all of that in the show notes because I'm sure that some people are gonna wanna keep up with you and continue to hear from you.

0:42:58

Doctor Natalie, thank you so much for joining me today. I really enjoyed this conversation. Yeah. It's it's been such a gift. Thank you. You're an inspiration and I look forward to staying in touch. Thank you so much. Thank you for listening to today's episode of Notes From Your Accupuncturist. If you liked what you heard, please follow this show leader rating or review, or just tell someone about it. And if you want to join the conversation, you can subscribe to Notes From Your Acupuncturist on SubStack, where you can comment, ask questions, participate in discussion threads, watch videos, and read more of my reflections on acupuncture and healing. Huge thanks as always to our paid subscribers for helping keep this work sustainable. You too can become a paid subscriber for just a you dollars a month. Just head over to substack dot com and search notes from your Accupuncturist or click the link in the show notes. Until next time, This is Alexa Bradley Hulsey, your acupuncturist signing off with love and gratitude.

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